Parenting Hell: Beckett and Widdicombe podcast 'redressing the balance'

In April 2020, during the early stages of the Covid-19 pandemic, comedians Rob Beckett and Josh Widdicombe launched Lockdown Parenting Hell - a podcast which very much did what it said on the tin.

With schools closed and the future uncertain, it was an outlet for the two hosts and their listeners to vent frustration about the difficulties of being stuck at home with young children.

The huge, immediate success of the podcast took even its two presenters somewhat by surprise. Two-and-a-half years since its launch, it can still be found regularly sitting at the top of the charts. The fact that one of the most popular podcasts in the UK consists of two men talking about fatherhood has not gone unnoticed.

"There are lots of stereotypes that surround parenting," Widdicombe tells BBC News. "And one of them is the dad that just wants to go out with his mates and play golf at the weekend and stuff.

"And it's like, while we complain about parenting, what I'd really hope comes across is that we feel really passionately about wanting to spend a lot of our time doing it, and doing it well. And so we're complaining from a point of loving it, and finding it difficult because we're throwing ourselves into it."

Parenting Hell (which eventually lost the "Lockdown" from its title) is an engaging listen. The pair's chemistry is entertaining, and guests such as consumer campaigner Martin Lewis and author Philippa Perry offer practical advice as well as their own anecdotes about parenting.

"It's nice to be able to talk about [parenting], and have other people appreciate it," reflects Beckett. "And also accept that, I love my kids to pieces and try my best, but sometimes I'm rubbish at it. And that's life. And if you don't accept you're rubbish at it sometimes, you'll never get better."

Beckett and Widdicombe are about to publish their first joint book - a companion to the podcast - which features largely new material. "We realised because we started a podcast when our kids were three, I had like three years of stories and anecdotes which have never been on the podcast," Beckett notes.

Even if you've never listened to it, you will recognise both Beckett and Widdicombe if you've watched pretty much any comedy panel show in the last decade. And yet, it is the podcast which is increasingly becoming the thing each of them is best known for.

"All we did was be honest, and it was sort of a success by accident," says Beckett. "I think it's refreshing to hear two blokes talking about how they feel."

But Anita Cleare, parenting coach and author of The Work/Parent Switch, cautions that, however popular the podcast is, it's arguably being judged by different standards because of its hosts.

"It doesn't surprise me to see two men so successful in the parenting space. Dads have much less pressure on them to be perfect parents," she tells BBC News.

"Coming from a position where men traditionally had quite a limited role in childcare, we tend to celebrate today's more hands-on and engaged dads whereas mums are just expected to be that way."

She adds: "The pressure on mums to do it all is immense. Many mums feel judged if they ask for help or admit that they are finding parenting hard or that they don't always enjoy being with their children.

"Dads are coming from a trajectory of previously very low expectations. That brings a certain freedom to talk about parenting in different ways, to be really honest about the struggles, to find the humour and subvert conventions."

Beckett suggests that part of the appeal for female listeners could lie in getting an insight into their partner's psyche. "I think, sometimes, the mums that listen might be a bit like, 'oh, maybe that's why he's acted like that'. So it's a bit like you get to hear the other side of it, which is always interesting," he says.

"You know, I'm an Arsenal fan. If Tottenham lose, I love listening to a Tottenham podcast, to hear them upset," he jokes. "Arsenal Fan TV is watched by all the away fans rather than the Arsenal fans!"

The podcast's success implies there was a gap in the market, but Widdicombe says: "It wasn't a gap we spotted. If there was a gap, we fluked upon it... I don't think we initially set out to change any attitudes. So if we have that's a really nice thing."

Parenting Hell has boosted the profile of both hosts individually. Recently, for example, Beckett has been doing more live broadcasting, with a weekend show on BBC Radio 2.

"I love doing live radio, I think it's quite a different skill to podcasting," he says. "You're properly live, you can get people on the phone, and it's just happening in that moment. And whatever you say, that's it, there's no edit. And I've really enjoyed the slot."

His appointment, however, was somewhat controversial, as Radio 2 bosses cut the number of shows hosted by Paul O'Grady to make room for Beckett in the schedule. O'Grady eventually left the station, telling fans he was unhappy with the arrangement.

"Paul O'Grady is an absolute legend and hero of mine, I love Paul O'Grady," Beckett says. "It's a shame that he doesn't want to do it anymore. That's up to him, that's his decision, but yeah, I was really happy to get the opportunity. If someone says to you, 'do you want to host a show on Radio 2?' and your job is a broadcaster, you say yes. The rest of it's not up to me, I just turn up and give it a good go."

But whatever the other projects Beckett and Widdicombe are working on, the podcast is arguably now the biggest show either of them is attached to. Both are pleased to have been praised for realistic portrayals of parenting.

"There are all these cultural pressures that surround parenting, whether it be breastfeeding, screen time, whether your child is potty trained, or whether you're using a weekend with them to teach them pottery and put on Instagram," Widdicombe says.

"I'm not saying these things shouldn't exist, and these things shouldn't be out there. But maybe we're redressing the balance a bit on people showing that they've got a perfect life for their children."

The pair make light of the fact that they aren't parenting experts with a note on the book's cover which reads: "100% no advice guaranteed."

It's a sentiment echoed by Cleare. "Rob and Josh are very clear that they're just telling it how it happens in their lives and they're incredibly funny," she says. "But if you are looking for parenting advice, I would remind parents to choose sources of information that are based on research and clinical evidence."

The book is intended as a generally light-hearted read, but there is no shying away from serious subjects. At one point, Widdicombe writes movingly about the time he and his wife Rose experienced a miscarriage.

"I don't think there's any duty to write about that or a feeling that you have to speak about, because I think each their own," he says. "But I just really wanted to say what that experience was like, because I think it's something that's not talked about enough for you to realise how prevalent it is." (It's estimated one in four pregnancies in the UK end in miscarriage.)

"Everything's different for everyone. So all you can do is write about your own experience, honestly. And hopefully people will respond to that."

Parenting Hell The Book by Rob Beckett and Josh Widdicombe is released on Thursday. The pair will appear at the Southbank Centre's London Literature Festival on 30 October.